The Damage of Hip Hop?

[Guest Diddybob]

Hip Hop is to blame partly. But remove Hip Hop and many of the same problems(in fact all of the same problems) will still exist. There is a lot of bad, but also it is the only genre where you can have artists like Immortal Technique and Dead Prez at the same time, all these 80's rnb crooners weren't doing shit for black communities either, just because they weren't pushing violence doesn't mean they were productive in pushing their culture forwards,  for all this talk about it being bad it is still the only genre where rappers would push black political movements. Like i said, none of these rnb singers were talking about 5% knowledge. Hip Hop is only a mirror to wider society, if you grew up in a poor area with very little in a capitalist society its only common sense that you would value materialism highly.

[Fighting Weight]

Tech and Dead Prez are not mainstream rap

 

They're hip hop artists

 

speaking of which

 

[Guest Diddybob]

Sugarhill Gang made a club banger

 

Doesn't have to be aggresive / lewd etc to be a club track, though I think this basically makes the point that to be a good club track / entertaining it has to be the former

 

the era with the absolute best dance tracks (the 70s) had none of that

 

 

My niggas on soul train could still get down

 

 

It had none of that, but they still had crack cocaine and countless drug dealers.

 

The Alpos, and Rich Porters that this era look up to all grew up in that era.

 

They weren't listening to no rap, yet they still found a way to do badness, in fact that era 70's and 80's shits on this era in terms of crime statistics, drug problems etc. Niggas were listening to Sam Cooke and Bootsy Collins while they were bodying niggas.

[The Somalian]

dead prez>>>>>>>

 

[Fighting Weight]

Stop trolling 

 

I did not say hip hop invented evil

 

I said it is a negative influence 

[Guest Diddybob]

And Sugarhill made a club banger that was still very materialistic.

 

 

 

ya see i'm six foot one and i'm tons of fun 
and i dress to a t 
ya see i got more clothes than muhammad ali and i dress so viciously 
i got bodyguards, i got two big cars 
that definitely aint the wack 
i got a lincoln continental and a sunroof cadillac 
so after school, i take a dip in the pool 
which really is on the wall 
i got a color tv so i can see 
the knicks play basketball 
hear me talkin bout checkbooks, credit cards 
more money than a sucker could ever spend 
but i wouldnt give a sucker or a bum from the rucker 
not a dime til i made it again 

source: http://www.lyricsondemand.com/onehitwonders/rappersdelightlyrics.html

[Guest Diddybob]

Stop trolling 

 

I did not say hip hop invented evil

 

I said it is a negative influence 

 

KL

[Flojo]

Sugarhill Gang made a club banger

 

Doesn't have to be aggresive / lewd etc to be a club track, though I think this basically makes the point that to be a good club track / entertaining it has to be the former

 

the era with the absolute best dance tracks (the 70s) had none of that

 

 

My niggas on soul train could still get down

 

It's funny you reference this as Malcolm X felt exactly the same about music generally back then as you feel about rap music now so I suppose it's all relative really.

[Guest Diddybob]

Sugarhill Gang made a club banger

 

Doesn't have to be aggresive / lewd etc to be a club track, though I think this basically makes the point that to be a good club track / entertaining it has to be the former

 

the era with the absolute best dance tracks (the 70s) had none of that

 

 

My niggas on soul train could still get down

 

It's funny you reference this as Malcolm X was around at the time this music was popular and felt exactly the same about it then as you feel about rap music now so I suppose it's all relative really.

 

Thats cause all them niggas used to do is dance, hardly any of them were saying anything useful politically.

[Flojo]

From reading his autobio I never got the impression he had time for music, he just generally thought that for black people there were more pertinent issues to be concerned with than shucking and jiving.

[Fighting Weight]

Malcolm X issue was with black people as entertainers / singers when there were more pressing matters at hand

 

Hardly the same thing

 

/

 

I don't even know why people are disagreeing with me 

 

Mainstream music is far too oversexualised, overly violent, and overly materialistic 

 

It can't even be argued

 

Yes all these things are obviously products of the times we live in but who do you think pushes this music and this identity

[Woodpecker]

all un-natural, privatized elements of the world are designed to make people spend money

[stacksbranning]

Hip Hop is to blame partly. But remove Hip Hop and many of the same problems(in fact all of the same problems) will still exist. There is a lot of bad, but also it is the only genre where you can have artists like Immortal Technique and Dead Prez at the same time, all these 80's rnb crooners weren't doing sh*t for black communities either, just because they weren't pushing violence doesn't mean they were productive in pushing their culture forwards,  for all this talk about it being bad it is still the only genre where rappers would push black political movements. Like i said, none of these rnb singers were talking about 5% knowledge. Hip Hop is only a mirror to wider society, if you grew up in a poor area with very little in a capitalist society its only common sense that you would value materialism highly.

 

I know for a fact that black on  black crime sky rocketted in the u,s when people started to rap and  the same can be said in the u.k  . Especially in london ....Once cable t,v ,mtv base,and youtube gave a platform for us to see u.s rap more frequently and niggas started making these "chupid road rap" videos  knife crime went up as did gun crime.

[Flojo]

It's not that I disagree it's just I think we as the human race have been f*cked from the outset, people point to times gone by as if they were some sort of golden years for humanity when in fact we've always struggled with morals, decency etc etc 

 

Yes commercial rap music is on the whole quite negative but when it didn't exist did we have the same problem? I think we did.

 

It's like when people cite the waning influence of religion as the main reason for our problems today, considering how things worked out when religion was more widely accepted I can't to take that talk seriously.

[Guest Diddybob]

Hip Hop is to blame partly. But remove Hip Hop and many of the same problems(in fact all of the same problems) will still exist. There is a lot of bad, but also it is the only genre where you can have artists like Immortal Technique and Dead Prez at the same time, all these 80's rnb crooners weren't doing sh*t for black communities either, just because they weren't pushing violence doesn't mean they were productive in pushing their culture forwards,  for all this talk about it being bad it is still the only genre where rappers would push black political movements. Like i said, none of these rnb singers were talking about 5% knowledge. Hip Hop is only a mirror to wider society, if you grew up in a poor area with very little in a capitalist society its only common sense that you would value materialism highly.

 

I know for a fact that black on  black crime sky rocketted in the u,s when people started to rap and  the same can be said in the u.k  . Especially in london ....Once cable t,v ,mtv base,and youtube gave a platform for us to see u.s rap more frequently and niggas started making these "chupid road rap" videos  knife crime went up as did gun crime.

 

 

Not sure about that mate.

 

New York was far worse in the 80's than it was now.

 

And yes i know rap was around in the 80's but it was far less violent.

[Woodpecker]

ppl been nanking eachother up for at least 9000 years

 

watchu gon do?

[stacksbranning]

 

Hip Hop is to blame partly. But remove Hip Hop and many of the same problems(in fact all of the same problems) will still exist. There is a lot of bad, but also it is the only genre where you can have artists like Immortal Technique and Dead Prez at the same time, all these 80's rnb crooners weren't doing sh*t for black communities either, just because they weren't pushing violence doesn't mean they were productive in pushing their culture forwards,  for all this talk about it being bad it is still the only genre where rappers would push black political movements. Like i said, none of these rnb singers were talking about 5% knowledge. Hip Hop is only a mirror to wider society, if you grew up in a poor area with very little in a capitalist society its only common sense that you would value materialism highly.

 

I know for a fact that black on  black crime sky rocketted in the u,s when people started to rap and  the same can be said in the u.k  . Especially in london ....Once cable t,v ,mtv base,and youtube gave a platform for us to see u.s rap more frequently and niggas started making these "chupid road rap" videos  knife crime went up as did gun crime.

 

 

Not sure about that mate.

 

New York was far worse in the 80's than it was now.

 

And yes i know rap was around in the 80's but it was far less violent.

 

I think this is the era where it is at its least violent if im tbh . What with the likes of j cole,kendrick,drake polluting the airwaves

 

[Benicio del Toney]

ah dissapointed at 50 here

 

always seemed like he had his head screwed on andwas in charge of his emotions

 

the truth behind hiphop

 

2 Ls in two weeks for fif 

 

na u gotta realise this is the baby mum

 

like troy ave said they have a real nigga looking like a f*cking coward/herb

[Benicio del Toney]

 

sh*t parents are more to blame than mindless music

 

Well no, and nobody in this thread has stated that rap is the sole cause of evil in the world, simply that it's an extremely negative influence

Yeah it has a negative influence but when you are of a certain age 17+ you should be able to know this sh*t is entertainment and not real life

 

most rap is parental advisory so it aint really the "rappers" responsibility that the kids parent is lackadaisical and their 13 year old is downloading & listening to Lil wayne or Jay-z 

 

Bro, did your mum always know what you were downloading on the net?

[The Infamous]

nah i was listening to rap from morning

 

its never been a issue in my household 

[Benicio del Toney]

 You can raise your child to beleive whatever you want, but you still have to send them out into the world, and for 8 hours a day they are at school with other kids, and then at home they may watch TV

 

/Thread

 

 

Some people will get the shock of their lives when they have kids.

[Benicio del Toney]

Hip Hop is to blame partly. But remove Hip Hop and many of the same problems(in fact all of the same problems) will still exist.

 

Maybe, but the black community would probably be further by now.

Hip Hop has definitely held us back 20 years or so.

 

There is a lot of bad, but also it is the only genre where you can have artists like Immortal Technique and Dead Prez at the same time, all these 80's rnb crooners weren't doing sh*t for black communities either, just because they weren't pushing violence doesn't mean they were productive in pushing their culture forwards,  for all this talk about it being bad it is still the only genre where rappers would push black political movements. Like i said, none of these rnb singers were talking about 5% knowledge. Hip Hop is only a mirror to wider society, if you grew up in a poor area with very little in a capitalist society its only common sense that you would value materialism highly.

 

Berry Gordy used to take black kids from similar poor neighbourhoods and dress them in suits and give them media training so they could articulate themselves and show black people in a positive light.

 

That is a lot more progressive than the majority of mainstream Hip Hop.

 

 

In terms of positive content

 

Think about songs like Sam Cooke - Change is gonna come.

 

Marvin Gaye - What's going on?

 

James Brown - I'm black and I'm proud.

 

There was plenty of political material which was productive for the culture.

[Guest Diddybob]

Mate all types of fuckery was going on in Motown. Yes they were appearing well on the outside, but a lot of them were dabbling heavy with drugs, sleeping with each others wives etc, they were friendly and safe but they never rattled white America even though they were living through some of the worst times in regards to racism and inequality.

 

And James Brown and Marvin Gaye alongside the likes of Isacc Hayes were some of the first artists to mix political rhetoric into their songs, but even then they never went as far as the likes of Dead Prez, Mos Def etc when talking about black issues. Hip Hop is the first genre where you can find rappers like Immortal Technqiue and Lupe Fiasco actively critiquing American policy.

 

Even the songs you mentioned are very watered down ambiguous songs. James Brown was more powerful and you can see why he had so much influence in the evolution of rap.

[Woodpecker]

was gonna post suttin, re-read it

 

not tryna get bodied by the CIA

 

im done

[Benicio del Toney]

Mate all types of f*ckery was going on in Motown. Yes they were appearing well on the outside, but a lot of them were dabbling heavy with drugs, sleeping with each others wives etc, they were friendly and safe but they never rattled white America even though they were living through some of the worst times in regards to racism and inequality.

 

They definitely did rattle white America but in a Martin Luther King way, not a Malcolm X way.

 

Having that many black faces on Vinyl covers in white homes and on tv in white homes made progress possible in a way ranting and raving couldn't have done.

 

And James Brown and Marvin Gaye alongside the likes of Isacc Hayes were some of the first artists to mix political rhetoric into their songs, but even then they never went as far as the likes of Dead Prez, Mos Def etc when talking about black issues. Hip Hop is the first genre where you can find rappers like Immortal Technqiue and Lupe Fiasco actively critiquing American policy.

 

Even the songs you mentioned are very watered down ambiguous songs. James Brown was more powerful and you can see why he had so much influence in the evolution of rap.

 

There's a reason Dead Prez are not in the position Lil Wayne is though.

 

Yes there are some thoughtful intelligent rappers out there but they generally don't get out to the mainstream so the message is not heard by the masses, if we were to look at Hip Hop's contribution overall it has probably been more negative than positive tbh.