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Toney Barton

Aziz Ansari accused of sexual misconduct

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19 hours ago, Badman said:

You didnt answer my question though,

Not whether you told him you didnt wanted to fuck him but whether you told him you wanted to leave...

if you asked that then I could understand your point but it doesn't seem like you unequivocally emphasised that you wanted to leave which is probably the crux of the matter as it gives off mixed messages 

which leads me to my next point...the game, which ill explain next by addressing what you said below

 

 

More time this is all a part of the game. Its animalistic for males to chase females even if the females are not forthcoming, Its part of courtship to chase females and eventually attempt to have sex with them

To apply that to a typical situation, how many times have I had a female in my bedroom and shes going on long and I end up beating? more time the girl admits that she was just playing hard to get, but they always intended to have sex

Heck even some females like that dominating shit

I have even been in situations where it starts off awkward and perhaps the female is uncomfortable but I am able to pattern it and get the female to relax....am I hungry or over zealous to be doing that?  

I dare to ask whether you understand this concept but something tells me that either you are gonna act ignorant to all this, or as most females would, they would act a certain way about it but deep down they understand and acknowledge the game

So in light of this, can you at least understand where I am coming from? can you also understand the difficulties of being in a situation as a man? considering a female 9/10 will not initiate sex, and 99/100 will not come out and say they want sex, can you not at least see the difficulties of reading certain messages?

 

bro why are you acting like it isn't understandable that she was scared after he shouted at her?

I agree with everything that your saying objectively, but it doesn't apply to her situation.

He behaved aggressively and her first priority switched to her safety (not following up with i want to leave, but talking the situation down and then leaving), which is reasonable imo. 

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On ‎24‎/‎01‎/‎2018 at 1:29 PM, Grafter said:

Yh but I'm letting you know as a woman, immediately vulnerable (yes u can hit him with something or call police or shout but before u do any of that he can get u)

If a man is being over over like that and u did already say something like "dont want it to feel forced"

Then why would a woman think hes gna leave when asked? There's going to be an element of fear now.

I think that situations like this cant just be called o well life

I dont think we should be in these situations as matter of normality (his house or her house), we do need progression on this...

/

And thinking about it jus as food for thought an showin u lot what it's like to always be aware of your physical vulnerability as a woman

I once went to a man's house as a teenager. Absolutely no intention of doin anything with him, it was a trick BUT I was over confident an not thinking properly an assumed I be fine since i wasn't far from home (silly logic)

Once in the house this man started makin verbal indications that he wants to beat so i very brashly shut him down. Everything changed, he said loudly "u cant just shoot a man down like that". I was thinking shit shit hes blocking the doorway, how am I gettin out of here unscathed, what if i jus run past him? How many doors? 

I got out unscathed but spent maybe an hr or more listenin to his life story until i could gauge the right time to leave without offending him any further...

I get what you're saying but nothing in that story suggested she was scared. and deffo after she said the thing about being forced it should of ended there. But instead he pointed at his jeans and she crawled over to him and sucked him off... like come on... there has to be some personal accountability.

Tbh the whole thing read like he was being an over eager/creepy neek (especially the bit about tapping her on the shoulder and pointing at his d*ck with a smile).

But sexual harrasement? nah.

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1 hour ago, o-guy said:

bro why are you acting like it isn't understandable that she was scared after he shouted at her?

I agree with everything that your saying objectively, but it doesn't apply to her situation.

He behaved aggressively and her first priority switched to her safety (not following up with i want to leave, but talking the situation down and then leaving), which is reasonable imo. 

Please show me where I am saying or suggesting that its not understandable to be scared in such a situation?

My point was more the way she handled the situation not what she felt. She quite rightly felt scared however I am a firm believer that ones actions should not be determined by your emotions as emotions constantly change. This means you could potentially handle a certain situation differently depending on your emotions at the time which is vary dangerous imo

I personally do not understand this bit. I would say I am quite a street smart person and as such know how to handle and get out of hostile situations. If its a matter of safety there are a number of avenues you could go down but at no point would I believe that talking down the situation would be the best option to chose as it does the following:

Could anger the person more especially if the guy feels like hes being insulted/mocked

Not send a clear message of how his actions has made her feel which could send mixed messages - what if the guy thought that the reason she hasnt left yet was because she still wanted to stay? he may have been experiencing a level of ignorance and delusion caused by an inflated ego and experiencing embarrassment....might actually believe that he could redeem the situation as even though he did something wrong, she is still visibly standing in front of him talking

In that situation, instead of a shut down a simple time out and a mature discussion was needed - 'Sorry but I think there is a misunderstanding, I think you have got the wrong idea and I apologise for leading you on but I am not comfortable with this and would like to leave'. A degree of empathy to better understand the situation is very wise. Was a 'shut down' really necessary? 

The guy is not a mind reader. Unless explicitly instructed how does he know for sure that she wanted to leave?

Please note that there may also be a chance that the guy could react violently regardless the way you handle the situation therefore you only have 2 options at this point

1, Fight your way out of it 

2, Prevent yourself in getting into such a situation in the first place

Personally I know which one I would chose - I am a firm advocate that if you cant handle the fire then step out of the kitchen, getting into a situation you may not be able to handle is just long

Perhaps that situation could have been handled better for my man to save face, fair enough you never had intention of having sex with the guy but can you understand that going to a guys bedroom sends mixed messages and may result in the guy trying to initiate something? Should said guy be chastised for that?

Please note I am not trying to make excuses for the guy, my point was never about that, it was more to do with Aziz Ansari's situation and that I personally believe that its nothing more than mixed messages being misinterpreted and a lack of understanding to which I suggested lessons can be learned? The real Grace (Grafter) then talks about female vulnerabilities and basically playing the victim game which I am not a fan off at all as its very toxic and doesn't address the problem at all

At the same time I personally dont believe a young female can handle a situation that Grafter got herself in, being able to pattern a situation like that takes experience and wisdom which is why I mentioned that perhaps going into a guys yard like that was unwise, but I would like to think that after her experience lessons were learned, just like there's lessons to be learned in a lot of these kind of situations (like Aziz Ansari's)

Not this whole toxic and hate fueled anti male rhetoric, it does NOTHING to address the issue what so ever

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/

Wish I read that article Agony posted before writing my response

Need more women like that who can think objectively and not with an emotionally fueled negative agenda 

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You are wrong Francis sorry

You seem to think every single man in the world is reasonable an can just be spoken to nicely an everything will be fine. An its actually women that make the situation fuckry

You see this sad clean safe bubble u live in where women are the enemy, it need to burst. Ur so far into this "feminist agenda" u now have ur own

He tricked me into his house which I stated at the beginning. Too embarrassed to say how but mature enough to admit it was a shit trick. He got me to his room under false pretences, non sexual, so I didn't lead him on at all. 

Not goin over the story again because you are hell bent on tryin to tell me I handled the situation wrong. When I am telling you I was literally in fear of my life. I left when it was safe

 

Ego doesnt exist and if women would just be direct then they never have to be afraid

Whatever. I see ur stance on all these issues and its sorry imo

I dont have any empathy for an agressive man who cant understand plain English

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3 minutes ago, Badman said:

/

Wish I read that article Agony posted before writing my response

Need more women like that who can think objectively and not with an emotionally fueled negative agenda 

Hope you are not indirectin me with this

Really hope not

What is ur agenda btw?

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I was actually gonna put a disclaimer to indicate that wasn't the case but I was hoping you wouldn't think that :lmao:

it would be harsh to say your responses are negative and emotionally fueled however  your responses do seem to appear unbalanced at times

/

My agenda is raising my 2 daughters. This current negative climate is getting really bad and out of control. I am trying my hardest to maintain the balance (When most people refuse to) 

Ultimately the conclusion to this will shape how I raise them - to not get caught up in these kinda situations 

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Yes the fact you have daughters should be forcing you to want to understand as many female perspectives as you can

And understand the multitude of fuckry scenario that they are bound to face particularly if we cant have an honest conversation about unacceptable male behaviour and how it makes women feel

And know that you the only way you will be able to have even a small understanding of what they will face is by listenin to people who have actually been through things or what people wanna call "normal"

Your posts are literally always unbalanced when it comes to women. Because u see any advocacy on behalf of women as "feminist agenda"

I have yet to see you post ANYTHING in support of ANY woman in ANY story as long as these topics have been occurring

Even when u commented on the judge who sentenced that man to 175 years. Your comments completely trivialised the mans crimes. Goin on like she was bein petty buy sayin she is a woman scorned. She is a judge, educated and qualified to be in her field handin down an apt sentence to a fucking criminal

But to u she is just a scorned "female'

 

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Badman we're pretty much on the same page.

but whether it's better to honestly reason with the guy vs trying to manipulate him and the situation, is something we can only speak on if we were there.

and like you said your approach is more what i would expect from a big woman, not a teenage girl.

 

 

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1 minute ago, Grafter said:

Yes the fact you have daughters should be forcing you to want to understand as many female perspectives as you can

And understand the multitude of fuckry scenario that they are bound to face particularly if we cant have an honest conversation about unacceptable male behaviour and how it makes women feel

Your posts are literally always unbalanced when it comes to women. Because u see any advocacy on behalf of women as "feminist agenda"

I have yet to see you post ANYTHING in support of ANY woman in ANY story as long as these topics have been occurring

i thought he agreed with you on everything but how you handled the situation.

 

I think we all agree that the breddah shouldn't have shouted at you.

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1 minute ago, o-guy said:

i thought he agreed with you on everything but how you handled the situation.

 

I think we all agree that the breddah shouldn't have shouted at you.

I didn't see him mention once the impact of that mans behaviour on my own or acknowledge his behaviour was bad. 

An a grown woman would not have been tricked into the guys house on the whole

But once she is in the house however she got there, she faces the same danger an challenge and I reiterate from hes shouted an sat in my way i wouldn't advise any other woman to immediately continue with rejection. Best way is to understand what ur dealing with before u make a next move. This is the way physically weaker people have to process a situation

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This is why I said what I said about being unbalanced 

You are not addressing the points made and are being selective with your responses 

"This is the way physically weaker people have to process a situation"

This is a moot point and you are trying to cling onto it like its vindication

I myself have been in many situations where I have been the 'weaker' person / outnumbered / in danger etc etc etc

This is not an excuse to play the victim card or to excuse sloppy behavior. 

Also at no point have you taken any of my points on board and considered that maybe there may be some logic in what I am saying, I really can not see how progress can be made with such an attitude 

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34 minutes ago, Grafter said:

Yes the fact you have daughters should be forcing you to want to understand as many female perspectives as you can

And understand the multitude of fuckry scenario that they are bound to face particularly if we cant have an honest conversation about unacceptable male behaviour and how it makes women feel

And know that you the only way you will be able to have even a small understanding of what they will face is by listenin to people who have actually been through things or what people wanna call "normal"

Your posts are literally always unbalanced when it comes to women. Because u see any advocacy on behalf of women as "feminist agenda"

I have yet to see you post ANYTHING in support of ANY woman in ANY story as long as these topics have been occurring

Even when u commented on the judge who sentenced that man to 175 years. Your comments completely trivialised the mans crimes. Goin on like she was bein petty buy sayin she is a woman scorned. She is a judge, educated and qualified to be in her field handin down an apt sentence to a fucking criminal

But to u she is just a scorned "female'

 

On the contrary, I listen to a lot of perspectives, and just like the lady from that article, I appreciate perspectives like that more as they are balanced and dont contain any hidden agendas 

I have also been in situations like that too where I perceive my life to be in danger, same principals apply in that scenario 

/

If there is an unbalance I will call it out

Just because I do not comment on every scenario doesnt prove or show anything that is pure speculation 

I have been tirelessly fighting the injustices in this world wherever I see it,  (have even defended you on here countless times)

its a shame you fail to see that

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You yourself have been very selective in what you have responded to which is why I have had to keep repeating the same points

Please stop with the hypocrisy 

I am not talkin about what u don't say im talkin about the posts u make, always supportive or empathetic with bad male behaviour and always quick to dismiss or blame women

 

I handled my situation very well and the proof of that is i was unharmed and am still alive.

And i believe I was further vindicated when the man grabbed me on the road years later. He wasn't adverse to aggressively putting his hands on me years later because he still felt snubbed. Which shows i perceived the situation correctly

 

You havnt once acknowledge that behaviour like the man i dealt with and aziz is not ok, and we need to move away from it as a matter if normality or a bad date

Men can be better than that 

Gave my opinion on the aziz situ from the off but i am askin about the wider issue which u are choosin to be deaf to

 

Done with this now cos its just pure repetition

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There is a lot of slander in that post. Will give a proper response later

Whether you are done or not makes no difference to me, I’m not here to score points

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No slander just facts

Also dont understand what you mean by points

Im done because this isn't productive. Initially I thought it would be

With respect of course

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4 hours ago, o-guy said:

bro why are you acting like it isn't understandable that she was scared after he shouted at her?

I agree with everything that your saying objectively, but it doesn't apply to her situation.

He behaved aggressively and her first priority switched to her safety (not following up with i want to leave, but talking the situation down and then leaving), which is reasonable imo. 

I missed this before. Appreciate ur understanding

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4 hours ago, o-guy said:

I get what you're saying but nothing in that story suggested she was scared. and deffo after she said the thing about being forced it should of ended there. But instead he pointed at his jeans and she crawled over to him and sucked him off... like come on... there has to be some personal accountability.

Tbh the whole thing read like he was being an over eager/creepy neek (especially the bit about tapping her on the shoulder and pointing at his d*ck with a smile).

But sexual harrasement? nah.

Agree

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9 minutes ago, Grafter said:

No slander just facts

Also dont understand what you mean by points

Im done because this isn't productive. Initially I thought it would be

With respect of course

Yeah those are pure facts, let’s just leave it as that as there is no point arguing against fax and also convo is done according to you 🙄

 

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He has been falsel accused of sexual harassment.

The girl is a prick and the girl who wrote the article.  Man stopped the process when she said to stop but she was sucking d*ck and getting kicked out before hand. Her story sounds stupid, she probably wanted that to happy.

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