Underground Urban to Brit-Pop??

[Tirunih]

ayo Goddaz when is ur new material coming out?

[TF S4DK]

I got you.

[Guest No Mark]

master shortie sounds like fumin

[Afroman]

LMAO classic radio interview..

[FANTA]

rah imperial squad got signed? sick. that money maker tune was decent.lol @ Fugative. guy is getting around. did a photo shoot with him couple months back. good kid.

[Numero001]

It's not a send and the similarity is that theirs no reasoning.You're saying age isn't really a factor despite their being obvious reasons why it is.You're saying it's all about safe artists yet some of the biggest 'Urban' acts don't fit into this and the guy you named as being a good example flopped horribly. Then when it's pointed out you shift the point on to something else.

I said it isnt as big a factor as he is making out. I'm sure I wrote "it isnt the be all and end all you are making it out to be" to TF in a previous post.Wiley's a big old 30 year old man, signed to two different major labels in 2 years off the back of two big songs. Has Sway made a track you thought was good? Something you could see the same audience Tinchy supplies to would be interested in. Remember TF said you could switch Tinch and Sway.How can you prove to me Master Shortie flopped horribly? TF named Master Shortie first, not me. Who are some of the biggest urban acts (plural) who dont fit this?Both of you are coming with this big talk, beg you find me an example of where I have been proven wrong and moved on to something else. 2 quotes. This isnt a convo where you have to think, all posts are here.

You put Master Shortie forward as an act to back up your point about having an intimidating image working against you

I wouldnt sign Wretch or Scorcher either. Neither of them are safe acts, neither have made a song I would say yeah, hit. Whereas Master Shortie is a fun-loving safe act.

Sway doesn't have to capture the exact audience that Tinchy does to achieve chart success and I don't think he's trying to. His latest single sounds like kind of thing that would go down well in them places like Walkabout. I don't fully agree you could achieve the exact same success by switching roles but I think it would do considerably better with Tinchy behind it. Personally I don't rate Strider much, he spits and even if I listen I hear nothing cos I think he lacks presence and energy.Master Shortie flopped horribly because I remember thisand his wikipedia page says this

A.D.H.D is the debut album by English Hip-hop artist, Master Shortie[1][2][3]. The album was released on July 27, 2009 and has so far failed to chart.[1].

Wiley and Dizzee are two of the biggest and neither of them have a squeaky clean image, these days I don't think the youth are so easily taken by a nicely polished image which is why the days of boy bands like Backstreet Boys, Boyzone, N Sync etc dominating the charts are on the decline.I aint coming with any big talk like i know the ins and outs of the industry, I'm just picking up on some things you've said that don't really add up.

If you looked at the quote directly above you would have seen a post by P. Brisco which included the quote

Numero your a bit of a mug.I know everyone's ages. In regards to Wiley was he in the video for either song that charted? Has he ever had any mainstream success on a song he personally has fronted?Skepta put out Rolex Sweep, a corny video, doing a bootleg macarena, in a white suit thinking he MJ and talking about 50 Cent and Soulja Boy cant dance like me in a pub, with grannies, white girls, Timmy Mallet and midgets, I really think if anyone is intimidated by that guy then they need a reality check.Dizzee been in the mainstream audience for what 6 years now and he 24. Once your in it doesnt matter cos your in, you just gotta keep delivering, thus why we have a near 40 Jay-Z still leading the game. Kano already had the marketing money spent on him since 2004.Fam age is important, I'm in meetings with people that sign artists, and I'm asking them who they wanna sign or have signed recently and they telling me names like Fugitiv, Spl2rge, Imperial Squad, and I'm like cool but what about Scorcher and Wretch and man is telling me "ahh they took too long they should have got a deal, too late for them now" (as if they 35), and I'm like but Fugitiv aint really from the scene, you should get man from the scene cos once you sign them your only gonna tell them what producers to work with anyway, so there sound will be commercial regardless. Man look me in me face and said "he's not from your scene, but he'll fit into our scene" and then I thought well we do have Master Shortie...

I repeat, TF mentioned Master Shortie firstI repeat, From what I know Master Shortie is a fully independent artist. I done said you cant compare him with chart success, did I not? It is the music business, if for example he is in the black with his album (low investment and reasonable sales), that isnt a flop. He seems to be doing a lot of shows and getting in places many others arent (BBBM, Brrap Pack Tour...) so I'm not sure if he is doing that bad. I repeat, Wiley's success was based on the strength of the music not the age or look of the artist. I repeat, Wiley's song was sold on the beat and could have been anyone but him. I repeat, Dizzee was signed in a different time so isnt comparable to now. Them times, dudes were signed majorly based on underground heat hoping that would carry them through promotion wise. He was undoubtedly the biggest thing underground. Still remains to a certain level, but there does have to be more. Would he have survived if it wasnt for Mercury Music prize and critical acclaim that followed, I guess we'll never know, but that is down to quality of music. His success now is due to previous history, but moreso, the strength of current music. A few older white guys I have spoken to have purchased the new Dizzee album and didnt know anything apart from Fix Up Look Sharp previously. And he isnt signed right now, hes indie There are always exceptions to the rule, good pop music will overule any laws when labels see money can be made. It is the music business. This is why we have trends. Labels invent these rules they abide by which they think the consumers want, flood the market, then good music from another source comes and f*cks with their sh*t, they jump on that.When it comes to black music, safe acts/people who arent intimidating will usually be easy picks for labels. Reason why Romeo and Lisa Maffia were the people who got the music deals. Asher went a different route and got success yes, but I couldnt tell you how or why he managed that so I wont speak on it.Same thing why white people who get praised for singing like black people get further than black singers. Why Another Level got so far, yet Damage didnt get as far. TF put forward the swap Tinchy with Sway switch comparison so that "doesnt have to capture" is void to this discussion.Sometimes I wonder if people actually read on this place.And wheres your proof for changing the subject when something is proven against what I've said?

[TF S4DK]

Lol this guy...

[Numero001]

Oh sh*t, I just clocked, you fell into my trap. Wiley as an artist isnt a big pop success. He had one top 5 and another was top 20. He wasnt the face of either song. He cannot be mentioned alongside Tinchy, N-Dubz, Chipmunk and Dizzee. I'd go as far as saying Ironik is bigger than Wiley, maybe even Master Shortie but thats a toughie. Dont catch feelings, I'm just saying.And once again, I repeat when I say safe, I never meant squeeky clean, boyband pin-up safe. Dappy is far from squeeky clean, but in reality, he's harmless. Some cheeky, safe-rebel

[Numero001]

I said it isnt as big a factor as he is making out. I'm sure I wrote "it isnt the be all and end all you are making it out to be" to TF in a previous post.Wiley's a big old 30 year old man, signed to two different major labels in 2 years off the back of two big songs. Has Sway made a track you thought was good? Something you could see the same audience Tinchy supplies to would be interested in. Remember TF said you could switch Tinch and Sway.How can you prove to me Master Shortie flopped horribly? TF named Master Shortie first, not me. Who are some of the biggest urban acts (plural) who dont fit this?Both of you are coming with this big talk, beg you find me an example of where I have been proven wrong and moved on to something else. 2 quotes. This isnt a convo where you have to think, all posts are here.

Right for every Wiley there is a Tinchy Stryder, N-Dubz and Chipmunk.Now give a next 30 year old?Now let me tell you this, the next ones that the industry are looking at are Griminal, Imperial Squad and Devlin. Those three are basically signed. Then there is Spl2rge (looking at) and Fugitive (signed) like I said earlier. Fugitiv apparently got a CRAZY deal.Now you tell me there big & remotely commercial sounding songs without a youtube search...There being groomed cos they are young and basically can be f*cked no vaseline and can be aimed at a young audience.

Last time I'm addressing you. Your basic understanding is really bad. This is partially why we go around in circles. You dont read text in its entirety, nor do you think of your question then check to see if it can be answered in the post I've written. Plus I'm sure the above text was much shorterMaybe its how its written. Lemme give you 3-4 lines max so its easier to digest.I repeat, the reason there are more young artists doing well is they are the ones producing the music that sells.Wiley proved that you can be an old man, make a record that catches, walk out of the label, make another record that catches and get signed again. Sway has no one but himself to blame for making sh*t records. Remember that was the first debate.Now shouldnt they think "Well the last time Wiley got signed, he got disillusioned and walked out. I dont wanna spend money on an act who doesnt help market or even appear in vids"? The answer is they dont care, money talks and if its a hit the labels want in. That was written in the post you quoted if you didnt get all hot headed and actually read.Your next question (name another 30 year old) has f*ck all to do with anything. This all started from Sway/Scorcher/Wretch being too old. I have proven that they are not too old, they are sh*t (commercially). Make a hit then we'll see. I'm sure Ive asked you to find me a song an older artist has made that you think should have bussA labels formula doesnt make it what the consumers want. You work for labels, you should know they arent in touch. They go for easiest formula then hope it works. Whats really going on is the young artists are the ones making the best pop music right now. Remember when everyone thought bassline would take off after Heartbroken? Many, including I always said it was a one-hit genre, check the post history. If you cant be arsed, I'll do it myself another time.A record label signed Migraine Skank off the success of HSKT. It flopped.So Solid, then Pay As U Go, HLC...Mixtape rappers: 50 Cent then you had Cassidy, Grafh, Papoose, Saigon...FAO everyone else, the problem with this conversation is its realist/consumer vs. blind sheep/label. This is partially the reason why people are disillusioned with new music and why music sales are down. TF is an example of formulas for hits, I am someone who recognises there isnt actually a formula for success. There are elements, but its not an equation of X + Y = 100% hit.Ive given away waaaaaaaaayyyyyyy too much for you. Now you can go and do your job effectively, but remember who told you.

[Flojo]

It's not a send and the similarity is that theirs no reasoning.You're saying age isn't really a factor despite their being obvious reasons why it is.You're saying it's all about safe artists yet some of the biggest 'Urban' acts don't fit into this and the guy you named as being a good example flopped horribly. Then when it's pointed out you shift the point on to something else.

I said it isnt as big a factor as he is making out. I'm sure I wrote "it isnt the be all and end all you are making it out to be" to TF in a previous post.Wiley's a big old 30 year old man, signed to two different major labels in 2 years off the back of two big songs. Has Sway made a track you thought was good? Something you could see the same audience Tinchy supplies to would be interested in. Remember TF said you could switch Tinch and Sway.How can you prove to me Master Shortie flopped horribly? TF named Master Shortie first, not me. Who are some of the biggest urban acts (plural) who dont fit this?Both of you are coming with this big talk, beg you find me an example of where I have been proven wrong and moved on to something else. 2 quotes. This isnt a convo where you have to think, all posts are here.

You put Master Shortie forward as an act to back up your point about having an intimidating image working against you

I wouldnt sign Wretch or Scorcher either. Neither of them are safe acts, neither have made a song I would say yeah, hit. Whereas Master Shortie is a fun-loving safe act.

Sway doesn't have to capture the exact audience that Tinchy does to achieve chart success and I don't think he's trying to. His latest single sounds like kind of thing that would go down well in them places like Walkabout. I don't fully agree you could achieve the exact same success by switching roles but I think it would do considerably better with Tinchy behind it. Personally I don't rate Strider much, he spits and even if I listen I hear nothing cos I think he lacks presence and energy.Master Shortie flopped horribly because I remember thisand his wikipedia page says this

A.D.H.D is the debut album by English Hip-hop artist, Master Shortie[1][2][3]. The album was released on July 27, 2009 and has so far failed to chart.[1].

Wiley and Dizzee are two of the biggest and neither of them have a squeaky clean image, these days I don't think the youth are so easily taken by a nicely polished image which is why the days of boy bands like Backstreet Boys, Boyzone, N Sync etc dominating the charts are on the decline.I aint coming with any big talk like i know the ins and outs of the industry, I'm just picking up on some things you've said that don't really add up.

If you looked at the quote directly above you would have seen a post by P. Brisco which included the quote

Numero your a bit of a mug.I know everyone's ages. In regards to Wiley was he in the video for either song that charted? Has he ever had any mainstream success on a song he personally has fronted?Skepta put out Rolex Sweep, a corny video, doing a bootleg macarena, in a white suit thinking he MJ and talking about 50 Cent and Soulja Boy cant dance like me in a pub, with grannies, white girls, Timmy Mallet and midgets, I really think if anyone is intimidated by that guy then they need a reality check.Dizzee been in the mainstream audience for what 6 years now and he 24. Once your in it doesnt matter cos your in, you just gotta keep delivering, thus why we have a near 40 Jay-Z still leading the game. Kano already had the marketing money spent on him since 2004.Fam age is important, I'm in meetings with people that sign artists, and I'm asking them who they wanna sign or have signed recently and they telling me names like Fugitiv, Spl2rge, Imperial Squad, and I'm like cool but what about Scorcher and Wretch and man is telling me "ahh they took too long they should have got a deal, too late for them now" (as if they 35), and I'm like but Fugitiv aint really from the scene, you should get man from the scene cos once you sign them your only gonna tell them what producers to work with anyway, so there sound will be commercial regardless. Man look me in me face and said "he's not from your scene, but he'll fit into our scene" and then I thought well we do have Master Shortie...

I repeat, TF mentioned Master Shortie firstI repeat, From what I know Master Shortie is a fully independent artist. I done said you cant compare him with chart success, did I not? It is the music business, if for example he is in the black with his album (low investment and reasonable sales), that isnt a flop. He seems to be doing a lot of shows and getting in places many others arent (BBBM, Brrap Pack Tour...) so I'm not sure if he is doing that bad. I repeat, Wiley's success was based on the strength of the music not the age or look of the artist. I repeat, Wiley's song was sold on the beat and could have been anyone but him. I repeat, Dizzee was signed in a different time so isnt comparable to now. Them times, dudes were signed majorly based on underground heat hoping that would carry them through promotion wise. He was undoubtedly the biggest thing underground. Still remains to a certain level, but there does have to be more. Would he have survived if it wasnt for Mercury Music prize and critical acclaim that followed, I guess we'll never know, but that is down to quality of music. His success now is due to previous history, but moreso, the strength of current music. A few older white guys I have spoken to have purchased the new Dizzee album and didnt know anything apart from Fix Up Look Sharp previously. And he isnt signed right now, hes indie There are always exceptions to the rule, good pop music will overule any laws when labels see money can be made. It is the music business. This is why we have trends. Labels invent these rules they abide by which they think the consumers want, flood the market, then good music from another source comes and f*cks with their sh*t, they jump on that.When it comes to black music, safe acts/people who arent intimidating will usually be easy picks for labels. Reason why Romeo and Lisa Maffia were the people who got the music deals. Asher went a different route and got success yes, but I couldnt tell you how or why he managed that so I wont speak on it.Same thing why white people who get praised for singing like black people get further than black singers. Why Another Level got so far, yet Damage didnt get as far. TF put forward the swap Tinchy with Sway switch comparison so that "doesnt have to capture" is void to this discussion.Sometimes I wonder if people actually read on this place.And wheres your proof for changing the subject when something is proven against what I've said?

This is exactly why I didn't want to get in a discussion with you, you really are like DMF.I didn't say you mentioned him first, I said you used him as an example to back up why a safe artist will be more successful than someone like Skepta.If you didn't think he was relevant to the discussion you should have just said ' nah master shortie cant really be included' but you tried to use him as an example. In fact I aint even taking the time to respond proper.Dizzee wasn't signed recently so isn't comparable to now but a few lines later you're talking about So Solid?Another Level were better than Damage in my opinion.So when you meant a 'safe fun loving act' you meant 'cheeky safe rebel': ok.How is my opinion on Sway & Tinchy void because TF put that point forward, what is this? I didn't know we couldn't have a difference of opinion.You're posts come like them leaflets in the bank, should be bare asterisks all over the place with explanations at the bottom saying what you really mean.

[Numero001]

It's not a send and the similarity is that theirs no reasoning.You're saying age isn't really a factor despite their being obvious reasons why it is.You're saying it's all about safe artists yet some of the biggest 'Urban' acts don't fit into this and the guy you named as being a good example flopped horribly. Then when it's pointed out you shift the point on to something else.

I said it isnt as big a factor as he is making out. I'm sure I wrote "it isnt the be all and end all you are making it out to be" to TF in a previous post.Wiley's a big old 30 year old man, signed to two different major labels in 2 years off the back of two big songs. Has Sway made a track you thought was good? Something you could see the same audience Tinchy supplies to would be interested in. Remember TF said you could switch Tinch and Sway.How can you prove to me Master Shortie flopped horribly? TF named Master Shortie first, not me. Who are some of the biggest urban acts (plural) who dont fit this?Both of you are coming with this big talk, beg you find me an example of where I have been proven wrong and moved on to something else. 2 quotes. This isnt a convo where you have to think, all posts are here.

You put Master Shortie forward as an act to back up your point about having an intimidating image working against you

I wouldnt sign Wretch or Scorcher either. Neither of them are safe acts, neither have made a song I would say yeah, hit. Whereas Master Shortie is a fun-loving safe act.

Sway doesn't have to capture the exact audience that Tinchy does to achieve chart success and I don't think he's trying to. His latest single sounds like kind of thing that would go down well in them places like Walkabout. I don't fully agree you could achieve the exact same success by switching roles but I think it would do considerably better with Tinchy behind it. Personally I don't rate Strider much, he spits and even if I listen I hear nothing cos I think he lacks presence and energy.Master Shortie flopped horribly because I remember thisand his wikipedia page says this

A.D.H.D is the debut album by English Hip-hop artist, Master Shortie[1][2][3]. The album was released on July 27, 2009 and has so far failed to chart.[1].

Wiley and Dizzee are two of the biggest and neither of them have a squeaky clean image, these days I don't think the youth are so easily taken by a nicely polished image which is why the days of boy bands like Backstreet Boys, Boyzone, N Sync etc dominating the charts are on the decline.I aint coming with any big talk like i know the ins and outs of the industry, I'm just picking up on some things you've said that don't really add up.

If you looked at the quote directly above you would have seen a post by P. Brisco which included the quote

Numero your a bit of a mug.I know everyone's ages. In regards to Wiley was he in the video for either song that charted? Has he ever had any mainstream success on a song he personally has fronted?Skepta put out Rolex Sweep, a corny video, doing a bootleg macarena, in a white suit thinking he MJ and talking about 50 Cent and Soulja Boy cant dance like me in a pub, with grannies, white girls, Timmy Mallet and midgets, I really think if anyone is intimidated by that guy then they need a reality check.Dizzee been in the mainstream audience for what 6 years now and he 24. Once your in it doesnt matter cos your in, you just gotta keep delivering, thus why we have a near 40 Jay-Z still leading the game. Kano already had the marketing money spent on him since 2004.Fam age is important, I'm in meetings with people that sign artists, and I'm asking them who they wanna sign or have signed recently and they telling me names like Fugitiv, Spl2rge, Imperial Squad, and I'm like cool but what about Scorcher and Wretch and man is telling me "ahh they took too long they should have got a deal, too late for them now" (as if they 35), and I'm like but Fugitiv aint really from the scene, you should get man from the scene cos once you sign them your only gonna tell them what producers to work with anyway, so there sound will be commercial regardless. Man look me in me face and said "he's not from your scene, but he'll fit into our scene" and then I thought well we do have Master Shortie...

I repeat, TF mentioned Master Shortie firstI repeat, From what I know Master Shortie is a fully independent artist. I done said you cant compare him with chart success, did I not? It is the music business, if for example he is in the black with his album (low investment and reasonable sales), that isnt a flop. He seems to be doing a lot of shows and getting in places many others arent (BBBM, Brrap Pack Tour...) so I'm not sure if he is doing that bad. I repeat, Wiley's success was based on the strength of the music not the age or look of the artist. I repeat, Wiley's song was sold on the beat and could have been anyone but him. I repeat, Dizzee was signed in a different time so isnt comparable to now. Them times, dudes were signed majorly based on underground heat hoping that would carry them through promotion wise. He was undoubtedly the biggest thing underground. Still remains to a certain level, but there does have to be more. Would he have survived if it wasnt for Mercury Music prize and critical acclaim that followed, I guess we'll never know, but that is down to quality of music. His success now is due to previous history, but moreso, the strength of current music. A few older white guys I have spoken to have purchased the new Dizzee album and didnt know anything apart from Fix Up Look Sharp previously. And he isnt signed right now, hes indie There are always exceptions to the rule, good pop music will overule any laws when labels see money can be made. It is the music business. This is why we have trends. Labels invent these rules they abide by which they think the consumers want, flood the market, then good music from another source comes and f*cks with their sh*t, they jump on that.When it comes to black music, safe acts/people who arent intimidating will usually be easy picks for labels. Reason why Romeo and Lisa Maffia were the people who got the music deals. Asher went a different route and got success yes, but I couldnt tell you how or why he managed that so I wont speak on it.Same thing why white people who get praised for singing like black people get further than black singers. Why Another Level got so far, yet Damage didnt get as far. TF put forward the swap Tinchy with Sway switch comparison so that "doesnt have to capture" is void to this discussion.Sometimes I wonder if people actually read on this place.And wheres your proof for changing the subject when something is proven against what I've said?

This is exactly why I didn't want to get in a discussion with you, you really are like DMF.I didn't say you mentioned him first, I said you used him as an example to back up why a safe artist will be more successful than someone like Skepta.If you didn't think he was relevant to the discussion you should have just said ' nah master shortie cant really be included' but you tried to use him as an example. In fact I aint even taking the time to respond proper.Dizzee wasn't signed recently so isn't comparable to now but a few lines later you're talking about So Solid?Another Level were better than Damage in my opinion.So when you meant a 'safe fun loving act' you meant 'cheeky safe rebel': ok.How is my opinion on Sway & Tinchy void because TF put that point forward, what is this? I didn't know we couldn't have a difference of opinion.You're posts come like them leaflets in the bank, should be bare asterisks all over the place with explanations at the bottom saying what you really mean.

Just say you cant be arsed to read and leave it at that.Throughout everything I've said, I've always maintained there isnt one rule. A general rule but not one rule. You and TF go on like I'm saying one ruleI didnt put him forward as an act, I was counteracting TFs point saying he is worse than Wretch and Scorcher.The reason I used So Solid is to show they used the safest (2 light skinned) of a bad bunch. I'm sure Harvey got a deal, not 100% but I remember some martial arts video. Not sure if that was major. It was to also show how far back.Dizzee minus Mercury Music Prize back then may have been a completely different story. Besides, he was signed by XL (I think) anway. Now there is no question he deserves to be where he is based on the musicThats your opinionThat was specific to Master Shortie, NOT a general rule. So youre right, no I never meant that. Dappy example was to show that I could never have meant squeeky clean like boybands. If youve followed you would know I never said squeeky cleanI didnt read past that point because TF put it forward that if they switched places. That was the point.You should just read the whole conversation not pick out highlights and join in when you please.Prime example of this, I say

I wouldnt sign Wretch or Scorcher either. Neither of them are safe acts, neither have made a song I would say yeah, hit. Whereas Master Shortie is a fun-loving safe act.

You take the half of the sentence that suits your argument and conveniently miss the point I've been making throughout the whole debate MUSIC. Put the 2 together and get the whole point. The more valuable one is the latter aka the one you missed out. And it was nothing to do with Skepta

[FANTA]

bloody hell @ all that text.f*ck right off.

[Brandnew]

Prophet wa gwan for the essays fam...and for the record Master Shortie aint signed but he has big time investors behind him...same thing really

[TF S4DK]

Oh sh*t, I just clocked, you fell into my trap. Wiley as an artist isnt a big pop success. He had one top 5 and another was top 20. He wasnt the face of either song. He cannot be mentioned alongside Tinchy, N-Dubz, Chipmunk and Dizzee. I'd go as far as saying Ironik is bigger than Wiley, maybe even Master Shortie but thats a toughie. Dont catch feelings, I'm just saying.And once again, I repeat when I say safe, I never meant squeeky clean, boyband pin-up safe. Dappy is far from squeeky clean, but in reality, he's harmless. Some cheeky, safe-rebel

[TF S4DK]

Numero you've read too many "How to break the music industry books"and this is why I cant debate with you, I'm telling you whats really going on and your waffling sh*t...Its like saying anyone can get played on Hot 97, but reality is if you aint using a SERIOUS radio plugger, got a industry co-signer, or got a serious connection with a PD, then FORGET ABOUT IT.Basically your any...

[TF S4DK]

Prophet wa gwan for the essays fam...and for the record Master Shortie aint signed but he has big time investors behind him...same thing really

Which is why I asked him whats fully independent and was Dizzee fully independent for his first 3 albums? But he didnt answer that cos it would dead his point...

[Brandnew]

alot of people would be dissapointed/quit music if they knew the reason behind their favourite artists success tbh

[Numero001]

Prophet wa gwan for the essays fam...and for the record Master Shortie aint signed but he has big time investors behind him...same thing really

Which is why I asked him whats fully independent and was Dizzee fully independent for his first 3 albums? But he didnt answer that cos it would dead his point...

When did you ask me that? Everyone knows he was signed for his first 3 albums. Whats your point? Did he have any number 1s or a number 3 album back then?I've never said it was easy you muppet. I'm telling you guys like Wretch and Scorcher need to concentrate on making hits that commercial audience will like. Guys like them dont fit the face so its gonna be harder for them. Same as Ghetts. When did I say this is the case for everyone? I recall saying the music game isnt easy, if you cant hack it, find something else to do.Blud, real talk, there are still outstanding questions on previous pages you havent answered. At least 2. And at least 1 on this page. Until you answer them, I aint answering sh*t. Continue skankin around topics drawing for "I know whats really going on out here man" trying to distract and deflect. Your posing questions yet you cant answer sh*t.

[TF S4DK]

Whats fully independent? Cos was Dizzee's first 3 albums fully independent too?

[TF S4DK]

Prophet wa gwan for the essays fam...and for the record Master Shortie aint signed but he has big time investors behind him...same thing really

Which is why I asked him whats fully independent and was Dizzee fully independent for his first 3 albums? But he didnt answer that cos it would dead his point...

When did you ask me that? Everyone knows he was signed for his first 3 albums. Whats your point? Did he have any number 1s or a number 3 album back then?I've never said it was easy you muppet. I'm telling you guys like Wretch and Scorcher need to concentrate on making hits that commercial audience will like. Guys like them dont fit the face so its gonna be harder for them. Same as Ghetts. When did I say this is the case for everyone? I recall saying the music game isnt easy, if you cant hack it, find something else to do.Blud, real talk, there are still outstanding questions on previous pages you havent answered. At least 2. And at least 1 on this page. Until you answer them, I aint answering sh*t. Continue skankin around topics drawing for "I know whats really going on out here man" trying to distract and deflect. Your posing questions yet you cant answer sh*t.

Dizzee was signed to XL, which isnt actually a major label.Master Shortee is SIGNED to a label. Who while aren't a major label, they are no different to XL.Which is why I ask what is "fully independent"?

[Numero001]

Why are you asking me questions? I told you I aint answering sh*t. You are trying to deflect without answering You are the only person who thinks Sat Night Hustle was anything. You still havent shown me a song to back why Wretch or Scorcher should be signed. You havent shown a song of Sways that we can all agree was worthy of commercial success. Or any "old" act that justifies them getting any dealLastly, I repeatAbout age is a big factor. In an ideal world they may like someone young yes, but are you telling me if a couple of the older acts started making them hits they wouldnt be interested?

[hhhhhhh8]

You havent shown a song of Sways that we can all agree was worthy of commercial success.

This isn't any worse than anything N-Dubz has produced.And this one I actually like. Pretty decent tune.

[Numero001]

Lol next

[hhhhhhh8]

Sick.

[TF S4DK]

Why are you asking me questions? I told you I aint answering sh*t. You are trying to deflect without answering You are the only person who thinks Sat Night Hustle was anything. You still havent shown me a song to back why Wretch or Scorcher should be signed. You havent shown a song of Sways that we can all agree was worthy of commercial success. Or any "old" act that justifies them getting any dealLastly, I repeatAbout age is a big factor. In an ideal world they may like someone young yes, but are you telling me if a couple of the older acts started making them hits they wouldnt be interested?

If you say I'm the only one then you clearly didnt read the thread...Fam this is where you dont understand how it works... Wretch & Scorcher dont have to particularly make a "commercial song" to get signed. If you did then a bag of man would have never got deals when they got deals, (the fact Wiley has to make a song should tell you something but let me not sway from my point) they just have to show they have a following, which they (Wrecth & Scorcher that is) do, as the label is only going to try and tell them what songs to make and who to work with anyway... Example Kano went from Ps & Qs to Feel Free... Labels dont just take meetings with you when you got songs in rotation, they do it when they hear your name from one too many people... Wretch and Scorcher attained that status from independent releases, features, radio and club shows.In the cases of Tinchy, N-Dubz and Chipmunk they where all in development, for at least a year before there chart success, making songs with the sole purpose of a commercial release and in some cases labels bringing them the song. Wretch and Scorcher cant even get this. So why they gonna start making commercial songs, if they know their projects are being released by independent distributors?! Start doing that and they look like Kano and (here's where I go full circle) Sway...