Bank Holiday Week 34 / CL Semis

[Flojo]

Very serious. Before the game you always know Ramos if Madrid get humilated & Pepe in that midfield role if Barcelona getting frustrated, and very likely to get sent off.

My main criticism of his approach was the increased aggression & tenacity. Knowing his team are victims of this 'conspiracy', surely you'd instruct your players to be more 'careful'.

Exactly, if you know your team are being targeted by refs why employ a game plan that massively increases the chances of you having a man sent off?If you try to bully Barca it's very likely you will lose a man, their team is full of very skilful players with ridiculously good movement so you're going to commit a lot of fouls unless you're extremely disciplined. Mourinho could have developed a game plan that falls somewhere in the middle of posing an attacking threat and being solid defensively.

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

Why was there no need for a plan B? Even Arsene Wenger could see a Madrid players was gonna get sent off. Really it was a matter of when not if...I swear people are forgetting Mourinho is the manager of REAL MADRID. Arsenal beat Barcelona at home. Arsenal approached the game at home to win and did, Real Madrid are suppose to be a stronger team (defensively & offensively) with a better manager.

As I said, there 'should have been no need for a plan B'. This is because his Plan A was working as he wanted, until a shocking refereeing decision turned the game. This is confusing me...it was a matter of when? So your saying if say Granero had of played instead of Pepe, and Garay played instead of Ramos, that would have been a better tactic as it minimises the amount of errors a ref makes?

[Mr Q]

It's going to be REALLY interesting to see what he does next week, because he cannot try and employ smash and grab then. Real Madrid fans would be livid if they didn't start attacking till the 60th minute

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

Very serious. Before the game you always know Ramos if Madrid get humilated & Pepe in that midfield role if Barcelona getting frustrated, and very likely to get sent off.

My main criticism of his approach was the increased aggression & tenacity. Knowing his team are victims of this 'conspiracy', surely you'd instruct your players to be more 'careful'.

Exactly, if you know your team are being targeted by refs why employ a game plan that massively increases the chances of you having a man sent off?If you try to bully Barca it's very likely you will lose a man, their team is full of very skilful players with ridiculously good movement so you're going to commit a lot of fouls unless you're extremely disciplined. Mourinho could have developed a game plan that falls somewhere in the middle of posing an attacking threat and being solid defensively.

So a defensive minded tactic/formation is now the equivalent of a bullying tactic?When did Real try and BULLY barca? smh. Swear Barca even commited more fouls last night that Real?There were no bully tactics (before the red card, afterward ramos was getting headloss), yet he still had a man sent off.

[Captain Planet]

Emirates Cup 2011 line-up is confirmedNew York Red Bulls, Boca Juniors and PSG join Arsenal in JulySaturday 30th JulyNew York Red Bulls v Paris Saint-Germain (2pm)Arsenal v Boca Juniors (4.20pm)Sunday 31st JulyBoca Juniors v Paris Saint-Germain (2pm)Arsenal v New York Red Bulls (4.20pm)

The Scots got dumped, for Boca.

Decent draw hopefully we can retain it againKeep that cabinet spilling over

[Michel Kane]

Very serious. Before the game you always know Ramos if Madrid get humilated & Pepe in that midfield role if Barcelona getting frustrated, and very likely to get sent off.

My main criticism of his approach was the increased aggression & tenacity. Knowing his team are victims of this 'conspiracy', surely you'd instruct your players to be more 'careful'.

Exactly, if you know your team are being targeted by refs why employ a game plan that massively increases the chances of you having a man sent off?If you try to bully Barca it's very likely you will lose a man, their team is full of very skilful players with ridiculously good movement so you're going to commit a lot of fouls unless you're extremely disciplined. Mourinho could have developed a game plan that falls somewhere in the middle of posing an attacking threat and being solid defensively.

So a defensive minded tactic/formation is now the equivalent of a bullying tactic?When did Real try and BULLY barca? smh. Swear Barca even commited more fouls last night that Real?There were no bully tactics (before the red card, afterward ramos was getting headloss), yet he still had a man sent off.

If over the last 3 Clasico's you don't think that Madrid have been playing in a more aggressive, tenacious way then boy...no point really debating further.

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

Whos talking about 'the last 3 classicos' though?Im talking about LAST night. If refs are making decisions based on the last 3 classicos then yeah, no point debating further really...

[TF S4DK]

Why was there no need for a plan B? Even Arsene Wenger could see a Madrid players was gonna get sent off. Really it was a matter of when not if...I swear people are forgetting Mourinho is the manager of REAL MADRID. Arsenal beat Barcelona at home. Arsenal approached the game at home to win and did, Real Madrid are suppose to be a stronger team (defensively & offensively) with a better manager.

As I said, there 'should have been no need for a plan B'. This is because his Plan A was working as he wanted, until a shocking refereeing decision turned the game. This is confusing me...it was a matter of when? So your saying if say Granero had of played instead of Pepe, and Garay played instead of Ramos, that would have been a better tactic as it minimises the amount of errors a ref makes?

When did I say that? SMH.

[TF S4DK]

Whos talking about 'the last 3 classicos' though?Im talking about LAST night. If refs are making decisions based on the last 3 classicos then yeah, no point debating further really...

Is your head in your ass on purpose?

[Michel Kane]

You don't think Madrid played last night's game with more aggression than usual?And TBH, fouls conceded won't necessarily indicate accurately how aggressive a team was being. Another example of stats not painting the full picture.

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

@ TF, Tbh, your initial point was that Mourinho got his tactics wrong because he played Pepe.You then went on to say that he shouldnt have played him, because when his tactic worked, Barca would then start playing up and Pepe would get sent off.The point im getting at, is that Mourinhos tactics were in absolutely NO way to blame for the 2-0 loss. The game pretty much hinged completely on the INCORRECT sending off.Some things cannot be legislated for.

[Captain Planet]

C/STF and flojo arent beign realistic imoWhat manager will alter his tactics to give allowance for a biased refIf thats the case then half the teams that travel old trafford when howard "12th man" webb is in charge will not even bother turning upReals gameplan was undone by a ref had saw a good vs evil type of view on the game just as per usual with real vs barcaThere was one point dring the game where messi was begging so hard with the ref, thumbs up and all sorts and i just knew he was just being a c*nt in guise of an angel

[Flojo]

You're looking at it as an isolated game, they're playing each other 4 times in quick succession so of course the previous games are going to factor in.Defensive tactics aren't bullying, but some of the challenges I've seen from Real over the past few weeks were attempts at bullying Barca off their game rather than trying to stifle / outplay them.You need discipline to play defensively against Barca which has been lacking from Real. Ramos, Pepe, Arbeloa, Alonso, Adebayor and others have all been guilty of making rash, stupid challenges so it's no surprise they've had men sent off.

[Michel Kane]

C/STF and flojo arent beign realistic imoWhat manager will alter his tactics to give allowance for a biased refIf thats the case then half the teams that travel old trafford when howard "12th man" webb is in charge will not even bother turning upReals gameplan was undone by a ref had saw a good vs evil type of view on the game just as per usual with real vs barcaThere was one point dring the game where messi was begging so hard with the ref, thumbs up and all sorts and i just knew he was just being a c*nt in guise of an angel

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

You're looking at it as an isolated game, they're playing each other 4 times in quick succession so of course the previous games are going to factor in.Defensive tactics aren't bullying, but some of the challenges I've seen from Real over the past few weeks were attempts at bullying Barca off their game rather than trying to stifle / outplay them.You need discipline to play defensively against Barca which has been lacking from Real. Ramos, Pepe, Arbeloa, Alonso, Adebayor and others have all been guilty of making rash, stupid challenges so it's no surprise they've had men sent off.

Correct. What happened in the last 3 meetings should be irrelevant. I agree again, yet Pepe was sent off incorrectly last night, and before the sending off, there were no malicious kung fu kicks from ramos as he likes to do when he has headloss etc. And the last point I also agree with, however, an incorrect sending off is what changed the game at the end of the day. and before that aending off Reals discipline was fine. So im failing to comprehend how TF can say that Mourinhos tactics were wrong....

[Flojo]

C/STF and flojo arent beign realistic imoWhat manager will alter his tactics to give allowance for a biased refIf thats the case then half the teams that travel old trafford when howard "12th man" webb is in charge will not even bother turning upReals gameplan was undone by a ref had saw a good vs evil type of view on the game just as per usual with real vs barcaThere was one point dring the game where messi was begging so hard with the ref, thumbs up and all sorts and i just knew he was just being a c*nt in guise of an angel

As a manager it's your responsibility to factor in everything when you set up your game plan.Potential weaknesses in the oppositionPoor playing surfaceFitness of your playersAtmosphereOfficialsetc etcMourinho has been banging on about how much influence Barca have on the ref for time so if he was aware of it he should have factored it in to how he set up his team.

[TF S4DK]

@ TF, Tbh, your initial point was that Mourinho got his tactics wrong because he played Pepe.You then went on to say that he shouldnt have played him, because when his tactic worked, Barca would then start playing up and Pepe would get sent off.The point im getting at, is that Mourinhos tactics were in absolutely NO way to blame for the 2-0 loss. The game pretty much hinged completely on the INCORRECT sending off.Some things cannot be legislated for.

I never said he shouldn't have played Pepe. My point is you cant complain about always playing with 10, when Pepe in that role is ALWAYS getting sent off. Last night it was wrongly, but in the other games he has and should have gone off. He is the #1 spoiler, they will draw fouls off him, they will target him.When we beat Barelona, most of the Barcelona fans initial response was "Song should have been sent off" that told me everything I needed to know about Barcelona...Now when you set out a team to spoil/bully Barcelona, that makes rash tackles like they did, you must know your gonna end up with 10.

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

@ TF, Tbh, your initial point was that Mourinho got his tactics wrong because he played Pepe.You then went on to say that he shouldnt have played him, because when his tactic worked, Barca would then start playing up and Pepe would get sent off.The point im getting at, is that Mourinhos tactics were in absolutely NO way to blame for the 2-0 loss. The game pretty much hinged completely on the INCORRECT sending off.Some things cannot be legislated for.

I never said he shouldn't have played Pepe. My point is you cant complain about always playing with 10, when Pepe in that role is ALWAYS getting sent off. Last night it was wrongly, but in the other games he has and should have gone off. He is the #1 spoiler, they will draw fouls off him, they will target him.When we beat Barelona, most of the Barcelona fans initial response was "Song should have been sent off" that told me everything I needed to know about Barcelona...

Ok so it is Mourinhos fault that Barca will target him and the ref will make a bad decision?Is that what you are saying?

[Michel Kane]

You must be doing this on purpose.Yes, Mourinho shares responsibility.IF YOU KNOW PRIOR TO THE GAME THAT BARCELONA WILL INFLUENCE THE REF & THAT HE WILL MAKE QUESTIONABLE DECISIONS, TELL YOUR PLAYERS TO BE MORE DISCIPLINED.sh*t, what's so hard to get comprehend about that?That's why Mourinho & Madrid players/fans should not feel like victims here.

[Captain Planet]

C/STF and flojo arent beign realistic imoWhat manager will alter his tactics to give allowance for a biased refIf thats the case then half the teams that travel old trafford when howard "12th man" webb is in charge will not even bother turning upReals gameplan was undone by a ref had saw a good vs evil type of view on the game just as per usual with real vs barcaThere was one point dring the game where messi was begging so hard with the ref, thumbs up and all sorts and i just knew he was just being a c*nt in guise of an angel

As a manager it's your responsibility to factor in everything when you set up your game plan.Potential weaknesses in the oppositionPoor playing surfaceFitness of your playersAtmosphereOfficialsetc etcMourinho has been banging on about how much influence Barca have on the ref for time so if he was aware of it he should have factored it in to how he set up his team.

I agree but only in the sense of a card-happy ref, beyond that is purely comicalNo manager should and will assume that a ref is going to give decisions against their players based on negative preconceptions before the gameIn that case lee cattermole will never play again because bruce will say "well refs know he likes to tackle hard so if he plays he will get sent off and simply cost us the game"No manager does thisEven the most cunty of guys van bommel will start games like these regardlessIf managers did this then there is a flaw in football andthey are giving inManagers contrary to rumour actually trust in the refs abilities to be unbiased before a game, it just doesnt always pan out that wayReal were denied the opportunity to play their game because of a ref that was lovestruck with barca as most people in the game are

[Michel Kane]

Stop it slime.

[Flojo]

You're looking at it as an isolated game, they're playing each other 4 times in quick succession so of course the previous games are going to factor in.Defensive tactics aren't bullying, but some of the challenges I've seen from Real over the past few weeks were attempts at bullying Barca off their game rather than trying to stifle / outplay them.You need discipline to play defensively against Barca which has been lacking from Real. Ramos, Pepe, Arbeloa, Alonso, Adebayor and others have all been guilty of making rash, stupid challenges so it's no surprise they've had men sent off.

Correct. What happened in the last 3 meetings should be irrelevant. I agree again, yet Pepe was sent off incorrectly last night, and before the sending off, there were no malicious kung fu kicks from ramos as he likes to do when he has headloss etc. And the last point I also agree with, however, an incorrect sending off is what changed the game at the end of the day. and before that aending off Reals discipline was fine. So im failing to comprehend how TF can say that Mourinhos tactics were wrong....

Previous games shouldn't factor but they do, some of the challenges Real got away with last week were questionable to say the least and Mourinho should have known that in Europe with the whole world watching it was unlikely they'd get away with it again.We'll never know if Barca would have been able to score had real kept 11 but if you surrender that much possession to a team as good as Barca it's very likely they will score at some point.I agree with TF because like he said you always got the feeling that Real were going to lose a man by allowing Barca to have that much possession.

[BATTY BOY BUM BANDIT]

You must be doing this on purpose.Yes, Mourinho shares responsibility.IF YOU KNOW PRIOR TO THE GAME THAT BARCELONA WILL INFLUENCE THE REF & THAT HE WILL MAKE QUESTIONABLE DECISIONS, TELL YOUR PLAYERS TO BE MORE DISCIPLINED.sh*t, what's so hard to get comprehend about that?That's why Mourinho & Madrid players/fans should not feel like victims here.

WHAT DO YOU MEAN MORE DISCIPLINED!?!?!?!?DEARY ME. THE RED CARD OFFENCE WAS HARDLY ILL DISCIPLINED WAS IT?SHOULD THEY JUST NOT TACKLE ALL GAME THEN OR SOMETHING???This is getting boring. Seems youre the one finding it hard to comprehend.

[TF S4DK]

Oh and I really dont wanna hear Arsenal fans cry about missing Diarra too btw.I give up talking to Anderson btw. Beginning to feel like a dog chasing his tail.

[Seydou]

Everyone coming out w/ the same statements Arsenal was coming up with a month ago.Nobody listened and said "Buuh, you're just bad losers", "Look at the stats".What makes this different./Wenger blames the ref and UEFA, he's a bad loser.Mourinho blames the ref and UEFA, suddenly everyone listens./[Tulse] One rule for Arsenal, one rule for other teams.[Tulse]